Oh, shut up!You can't. You are too busy eating your mother's doughnuts. I don't want any dough on my nuts. It will cost you dough to empty my nuts. I doughn't know how good you'd be.
Just relax
Do Straight Men Let Another Man Give Them Blowjobs?
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Just relax
rbkwp
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Oh, shut up!
Just relax
Shut up? I thought you'd be good enough to cause me to make lots of noise. What happened?
Hoss
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I've heard more than one married guy say his dick had no way of knowing who was pleasuring it.
Hoss
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Now we're getting somewhere . . .
It perplexes me how often this subject comes up, how heated the arguments get and how many straight people insist that their opinion of how sexuality should be determined is definitive, despite the fact that in their next breath they'll proudly proclaim that they've never had a same-sex dalliance, themselves.
What is it you call someone who claims to be an expert on something with which they have no practical experience? Oh, right! Someone who doesn't know what the Hell they're talking about. But, I digress . . .
At first, it seems irrational that "completely" heterosexual men, women and their gay/bi apologists even care who other guys fuck and what they call themselves. It's not like anyone's going around holding a gun to straight guys' heads and making them suck dick just to muddy the waters. There must be some reason why so many feel so passionately that "straight" must imply "100% straight and absolutely nothing else."
Bjen's own choice of words here clearly offers some very telling insight into the mind of the 100% straight man. If men who've had sexual experiences with other men also refer to themselves as straight, then you feel that your singular distinction as a 100% red-blooded, pussy-loving, "No Homo, Bro" straight guy is being taken away from you.
After all, what good does it do to tell people you're straight if that doesn't automatically and unequivocally imply that you're better than "those other guys" who are not? Right?
Smaccoms
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This is such a hot topic today, which is why this thread is so long. The majority of peoples' understanding of sexuality is so naive as a whole that when it's rightly challenged left and right by a minority, they have a fit! In essence, their world and understanding would completely disintegrate under the true reality, so they harshly resist instead. To open one's eyes to the truth in such a situation takes time, energy and an OPEN MIND!
OKAY, now quick tally--open minds open minds, who here has an open mind...
yea, not likely
OKAY, now quick tally--open minds open minds, who here has an open mind...
yea, not likely
I'm in a straight monogomous marriage, so I'm not 'involved'... but I think RichieDick couldn't have said it better. Pure sex (not making love) is about getting and giving pleasure... Does it really matter who is on the other end as long as you are all getting off??? JEEZ!Exactly! what's with the labels? I am a heterosexual man - what that means to me is that I don't fantasize bout having a boyfriend, I don't want a relationship with another man, I don't particularly care for kissing men, and don't like the idea of giving or receiving anal with men. BUT in sexual situations with my wife, if the other man is down with it, I suck cock. I don't think it's a big deal. I guess what i'm trying to say is I'm not closet gay, nor am I Bisexual as i consider those to be something a person has no control over, and in some cases even lifestyle choices and I don't feel that way. according to some of the responses here I would be closet gay or Bi at the very least. I am neither. i like SEX. period. It is what it is, whether it's making a pussy or a cock cum it turns me on so I do it. I am completely comfortable with my sexuality and I am LABEL free!
nuff said
B_Bjen2848
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idk where you were going with this, but it really has nothing to do with me being better than him/her or him/her being better than me or where ever you were trying to go with this to try and flip the convo onto something irrelevant (a common thing for this thread)
at the end of the day, all i am saying is this ...
no straight man does anything sexual with another man (yes, and 1 + 1 = 2, shocker, i know)
if a man were to do something sexual with another man, than he is bisexual (if he also does sexual acts with women), or gay (if he only does sexual things with men)
AGAIN
there is NOTHING wrong with any of this, people can fuck & suck who ever they want
what is wrong (relax, im not trying to hop on a high horse, not morally or anything like that, just basic knowledge and common sense) is saying one thing, when you do another
why call a car that is red, blue? there is nothing wrong with being red, just don't lie to yourself and think you're blue when you're red
why call a mac a PC? there is nothing wrong with being a mac, just don't lie to yourself and think you're a PC
why call a cop a doctor? there is nothing wrong with being a cop (unless you pull me over), just don't lie to yourself and think you're a doctor
so people, when you call yourself straight and then blow someone, or if you call yourself gay and then bang 5 girls, or if you call yourself a door when you're obviously a window, it makes you either look like an idiot, a nut case with schizophrenia, an asshole who is just trying to fuck with people for laughs, or a nice blend of all three
There's probably no point in responding to this, since you're clearly determined to simply not listen to any point of view on the matter that differs from your own, but here goes nothing . . .
I get what you're saying. What you don't get, what we've all been trying to illuminate for you, is that you have very limited experience with the broad spectrum of human sexuality. Due to that, your point of view is too narrow. Since you won't listen to those of us whose experiences are different from your own, that narrow perspective is preventing you from seeing the bigger picture. There are many shades of gray where sexuality is involved, yet all you can see (or, perhaps, care to see) is black and white.
Because of this, all the analogies you offered are faulty.
If I were to fix your car analogy for you, the reality of the situation is this: There is a car painted aubergine. You are standing in front of that car shouting, "STOP LYING TO YOURSELF!! YOU'RE FUCKING PURPLE!!! DEAL WITH IT!!!!!!"
Not only does it make you wrong, it also makes you a busy body. Do you make a habit of insinuating yourself into the private business of perfect strangers and presuming to tell them who they should be and how they should live their life just to suit your liking?
You may not feel like that's what you meant to do, since we're discussing sexuality in the abstract, but you have to remember that at the heart of all this we're talking about people. If you're 100% straight, then you're very lucky. A complete understanding of your sexuality was practically handed to you on a silver platter. Lots of other people weren't that lucky. The rest of us had wrestle with a lot of heavy shit just to figure out how to put into words what to tell people when our sexuality is questioned. Some of us had to go thru Hell to arrive at those answers. Lots of people have died trying to get where we are.
It's a total dick move for people like yourself to blow in at the finish line and say, "Nope. Your answers are too complicated. Makes my head hurt. It'll be easier for everybody if you just forget what you think you are and say you're [this]."
Do you get what I'm saying?
I get what you're saying. What you don't get, what we've all been trying to illuminate for you, is that you have very limited experience with the broad spectrum of human sexuality. Due to that, your point of view is too narrow. Since you won't listen to those of us whose experiences are different from your own, that narrow perspective is preventing you from seeing the bigger picture. There are many shades of gray where sexuality is involved, yet all you can see (or, perhaps, care to see) is black and white.
Because of this, all the analogies you offered are faulty.
If I were to fix your car analogy for you, the reality of the situation is this: There is a car painted aubergine. You are standing in front of that car shouting, "STOP LYING TO YOURSELF!! YOU'RE FUCKING PURPLE!!! DEAL WITH IT!!!!!!"
Not only does it make you wrong, it also makes you a busy body. Do you make a habit of insinuating yourself into the private business of perfect strangers and presuming to tell them who they should be and how they should live their life just to suit your liking?
You may not feel like that's what you meant to do, since we're discussing sexuality in the abstract, but you have to remember that at the heart of all this we're talking about people. If you're 100% straight, then you're very lucky. A complete understanding of your sexuality was practically handed to you on a silver platter. Lots of other people weren't that lucky. The rest of us had wrestle with a lot of heavy shit just to figure out how to put into words what to tell people when our sexuality is questioned. Some of us had to go thru Hell to arrive at those answers. Lots of people have died trying to get where we are.
It's a total dick move for people like yourself to blow in at the finish line and say, "Nope. Your answers are too complicated. Makes my head hurt. It'll be easier for everybody if you just forget what you think you are and say you're [this]."
Do you get what I'm saying?
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Aubergine...wow!....your sexiness just went up about a thousand percent with me.
I'm seeing a theme with this type of response, as this has happened a couple of times in this thread with other members too.
B_Bjen2848
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i understand there are MANY shades of gray when it comes to human sexuality, and that is great
just don't call yourself black (or white) when you are gray! what is so hard about that?
and i am not trying to tell people how to live their lives, stop trying to twist this into something that it isn't, me calling an aubergine car purple is just as ignorant, stupid, crazy etc. as a bisexual guy thinking & lying to himself saying that he is straight for no reason other than not being secure with his own sexuality
and i understand how shitty it is for people to get an understanding of their own sexuality, even in 2011 you see people young and old get ridiculed and teased for their sexual orientation ... and there NEEDS to be change ... if you want the world to accept everyone's sexuality, people need to be honest with themselves first, or else nobody will take them seriously ...
look at the politician a few years ago who got caught looking for sex in an airport bathroom, obviously he isn't straight (nothing wrong with that of course) but what is the first thing he said? "naw im not gay!" he makes himself look like a jackass, if he just owned up to it and said "yeah i like men & women, so what?" not only would the story have died out quicker, but he would probably be seen as a hero to those who are still struggling to find themselves
or that preacher ted haggard, he is a perfect example ... he got caught dealing with a male hooker and of course the dude exposed him, at the same time, ted is going around preaching about how bad homosexuality is and gay people are going to hell and all this other bullshit, and the funniest part of this story is when he goes to some bible camp to "get in touch with his hetero side" and he was "cured" ... everyone can see right through him, everyone knows he plays for both teams, everyone can tell he is full of shit .. he was so ashamed of who he really is that he had to put up walls and walls of lies to try and make himself feel better .. and to be honest, i feel bad for the guy ... this dude is over 50 years old and according to wikipedia he just came out this past feb to say that he bisexual (yeah, no shit) .. if you notice, there was no big news scandal about him coming to terms with his own sexuality, the truth is "boring" in news because its entertaining to see people make an ass of themselves, if he would have just came out from the start and said "yes, i am a bi preacher, who cares?" nobody would of even heard of ted
of course, preacher ted is a bit of an extreme with all the publicity, but now his name is tainted, not because he is bisexual, but because he looked like a fool trying to be something he wasn't ... all the guys on this thread who are "100% straight, but i can suck a good cock!" look just as ridiculous as the preacher except on a smaller scale
blow in at the finish line? i really am not trying to be a dick, and trust me, complexity does not make my head hurt .. stupid bullshit does
i would bet that if you saw me, bjen, the black guy (mom is black, dad is black) walking around telling people that i am half mexican and half asian, you would think i was an idiot who is just insecure with my own race, and you would be right
why is it that in everything else in the world, you can call it like it is ... yet when it comes to sexuality, you get jumped on for calling a spade a spade ...
Smaccoms
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for the sake of pure space, I deleted the middle part of the post. If you want to see it, scroll up (or go back a page).
I think the issue a lot of people have here is almost no one is "100%" straight and almost no one is "100%" gay. For this reason there is a growing discomfort with the gay/straight split with "bisexuality" filling the middle. "Bisexual" is the most obscure description of sexuality there is. It could mean a million different things, and the abuse of the term is almost universal. When examining this thread, it is clear the binary philosophy no longer satisfies many people in terms of describing their personal sexuality. It incorrectly implies a love/hate relationship (i.e. love pussy/dick and hate opposite).
There is a critical concept to understand here. Attraction and repulsion are two distinct, separate concepts. In terms of sexuality, you seem to be combining them into one (due to the incorrect implication stated above, perhaps?) You can imagine two scales if you will. Attraction (1 to 10: 1--great attraction, 10--lack of attraction) and repulsion (1 to 10: great repulsion, 10: lack of repulsion).
For example, on the given attraction scale, I would personally rate sucking cock a 9 or 10. At the same time, I would rate watching a girl get head also a 9 or 10. On the given repulsion scale, I would personally rate "fisting" a 9 or 10. I would also rate face shots of women in porn a 9 or 10 on the same scale. Based on the above description, am I gay or straight? Does the distinction truly matter in this case? Neither tells of my preferences of how I like to have sex, or with who. The term bisexual in this case is even less telling.
Consider the following phrase: "I prefer vanilla ice cream."
Based on that statement alone, attempt to tell me what my preference is on chocolate ice cream. Is that possible?
On top of this, not all likes and dislikes are set in stone--everything is relative based on one's point of reference. Concepts usually thought of as concrete (identity, sexuality, etc) are not. The miss-conception with the previous two examples often come from the concrete titles they are given (identity: your name, sexuality: gay/straight).
I'd love to type up another novel or two base don this discussion, but I'm late for work. Some of my stuff may also be faulty due to that fact. Peace yall!
B_Bjen2848
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with all that being said, you are bisexual because you like some things with women, and some things with men .. nothing here has changed
and if it is the titles that you, and all the closeted bisexuals who posted here before are pissed off about .. why must they suck a dick, and then hide behind a straight label when someone correctly states "sucking dick doesn't automatically make you gay, but you're at least bi"
Because is in this particular instance, you don't know what the definition of 'spade' is yet you continue to tell yourself that you do and expect other people to use the same incorrect definition that you do.
B_Bjen2848
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Okay, Bjen. I'm getting a sense of where your hang-up with this issue stems from - Closet Cases.
Also, I want to say that your last few posts have showed a genuine curiosity to understand that has been missing from previous posts in this thread and I want to thank you for that. This subject doesn't really impact your life, so a lot of people would have just lost interest by this point. The fact that you want to see the discussion through is really cool. I, also, don't want you to feel like you're being jumped on for expressing your point of view. I have an unhealthy fondness for profanity and sarcasm, which tends to make my posts read harsher than I often intend for them to be. Also, sexuality is a very sensitive subject for many people, for all the reasons you can imagine. Bear with me and the other contributors to this thread if it seems that we're taking this discussion too personally.
Believe it or not, I haven't been thinking about closet cases at all in this discussion. Looking back, it should have been one of the first issues addressed, because I believe it's their very existence that makes this subject such a hard sell for a lot of people. I'm not worried about closet cases, where this discussion is concerned. The Closet is such a colossal mind-fuck, such an untenable situation that it is virtually unsustainable, these days. Men of our generation will either succumb or they will achieve self-acceptance at some point. As for the Larry Craigs & Ted Haggards of the world, these sorts of things will continue to happen until we live in a society that refuses to tolerate homophobia. If this thread was created for their benefit, then a little encouragement toward acceptance is a good idea, but - as someone who was forced out of the closet by a roommate who riffled thru my stuff, only to discover that all of my straight "friends" he told had been discussing my sexuality and laughing about it behind my back - the path to self-acceptance is a process that shouldn't be rushed. It's a rough enough spot to find yourself in. Guys struggling in the closet don't need more grief heaped upon them for it, however well-intentioned.
Ironically, these are not the guys that stand to benefit from this discussion the most. This discussion holds the most import for straight people who believe that crossing swords while tag-teaming a hot babe makes the dudes gay.
Now. Here's the money shot: When you say "Straight guys don't do sexual stuff with other guys," you aren't just challenging the sexual identity of closet cases.
Believe it or not, there are straight guys whose sexual history involves same-sex encounters that aren't in denial about anything. They aren't living a double life. They aren't hiding anything from anyone. They aren't rationalizing. These are men who are completely secure about their sexuality who love women, but freely admit to having fooled around with dudes. They exist. They are real. I promise. Several contributed to this thread, for instance.
The difference is that ethnic background can be empirically established, whereas sexuality is a matter of self-determination. When you tell guys that they can't suck a dick and then "hide" behind a straight label, you're like Sharron Angle when she addressed a Hispanic Student organization and told them "Some of you look a little more Asian to me," while she was running for Harry Reid's senate seat. Both are offensive statements based on unfounded assumptions. You have no more right to tell someone that they are misrepresenting their sexuality than Ms. Angle has to tell them their ethnicity.
For instance . . .
Really? Are you sure about that? Cuz, in your very next post, you followed that up by saying this to Smaccoms:
Whether you feel like you're doing someone a favor, or not, it's not your place or anyone else's to tell a person what his/her sexuality is. That's something they tell you, and you don't get a say.
Also, I want to say that your last few posts have showed a genuine curiosity to understand that has been missing from previous posts in this thread and I want to thank you for that. This subject doesn't really impact your life, so a lot of people would have just lost interest by this point. The fact that you want to see the discussion through is really cool. I, also, don't want you to feel like you're being jumped on for expressing your point of view. I have an unhealthy fondness for profanity and sarcasm, which tends to make my posts read harsher than I often intend for them to be. Also, sexuality is a very sensitive subject for many people, for all the reasons you can imagine. Bear with me and the other contributors to this thread if it seems that we're taking this discussion too personally.
Believe it or not, I haven't been thinking about closet cases at all in this discussion. Looking back, it should have been one of the first issues addressed, because I believe it's their very existence that makes this subject such a hard sell for a lot of people. I'm not worried about closet cases, where this discussion is concerned. The Closet is such a colossal mind-fuck, such an untenable situation that it is virtually unsustainable, these days. Men of our generation will either succumb or they will achieve self-acceptance at some point. As for the Larry Craigs & Ted Haggards of the world, these sorts of things will continue to happen until we live in a society that refuses to tolerate homophobia. If this thread was created for their benefit, then a little encouragement toward acceptance is a good idea, but - as someone who was forced out of the closet by a roommate who riffled thru my stuff, only to discover that all of my straight "friends" he told had been discussing my sexuality and laughing about it behind my back - the path to self-acceptance is a process that shouldn't be rushed. It's a rough enough spot to find yourself in. Guys struggling in the closet don't need more grief heaped upon them for it, however well-intentioned.
Ironically, these are not the guys that stand to benefit from this discussion the most. This discussion holds the most import for straight people who believe that crossing swords while tag-teaming a hot babe makes the dudes gay.
Now. Here's the money shot: When you say "Straight guys don't do sexual stuff with other guys," you aren't just challenging the sexual identity of closet cases.
Believe it or not, there are straight guys whose sexual history involves same-sex encounters that aren't in denial about anything. They aren't living a double life. They aren't hiding anything from anyone. They aren't rationalizing. These are men who are completely secure about their sexuality who love women, but freely admit to having fooled around with dudes. They exist. They are real. I promise. Several contributed to this thread, for instance.
The difference is that ethnic background can be empirically established, whereas sexuality is a matter of self-determination. When you tell guys that they can't suck a dick and then "hide" behind a straight label, you're like Sharron Angle when she addressed a Hispanic Student organization and told them "Some of you look a little more Asian to me," while she was running for Harry Reid's senate seat. Both are offensive statements based on unfounded assumptions. You have no more right to tell someone that they are misrepresenting their sexuality than Ms. Angle has to tell them their ethnicity.
For instance . . .
Really? Are you sure about that? Cuz, in your very next post, you followed that up by saying this to Smaccoms:
Whether you feel like you're doing someone a favor, or not, it's not your place or anyone else's to tell a person what his/her sexuality is. That's something they tell you, and you don't get a say.
The definition of sexual orientation: The sex or sexes that an individual is physically attracted to.
Your definition of sexual orientation: The sex or sexes that an individual has willingly had sex with.
These two definitions are not synonymous. Action is not always caused by attraction nor does attraction always create action.
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