Pros and cons of being cut/uncut

[DC_DEEP]

Originally posted by prepstudinsc+Jul 7 2005, 08:33 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(prepstudinsc &#064; Jul 7 2005, 08:33 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-DC_DEEP@Jul 7 2005, 10:12 AM
See Galatians 5:2 - 6.

[post=327319]Quoted post[/post]​

That only applies to Christians if they were being circumcised for religious reasons. My quote was about Kosher dietary laws.

[post=327499]Quoted post[/post]​

[/b][/quote]
Kosher dietary laws? WTF? Dude, you are all over the place, this is about circumcision. My original post in this thread was directly related to circumcision for religious reasons, and you refute it with kosher dietary laws? You have completely lost me.

 

[prepstudinsc]

It was in response to posts 76 and 77, but it gives the answer as to why the practice is still kept by Jewish people.

 

[prepstudinsc]

What I don&#39;t really understand is why straight men don&#39;t really seem to care one way or the other if they are cut, but gay guys get so emotional about this topic.
We have straight uncut guys and they state the facts as to how they feel, their experiences being uncut, problems they&#39;ve had, but for the most part it&#39;s just very matter of fact. No offense here, but the many of the gay men get all bent out of shape that they&#39;ve been mutilated, they didn&#39;t get a choice, their parents owe them an explanation as to why they did what they did, blah, blah, blah. The straight cut men for the most part all just seem to the be like, "it&#39;s cool that I&#39;m cut" or "I&#39;m glad that I&#39;m not cut" and that&#39;s the end of the story. Can someone explain to me why the gay guys seem to be more upset with being cut and wanting to stay uncut than the straight guys?

Please understand I&#39;m not gay bashing here, it&#39;s just that it seems that it is the way this thread seems to pan out and I&#39;m just trying to figure it out.

 

[Dr Rock]

as it happens I&#39;m uncircumcized, but the primary reason I slam neonatal circumcision so viciously is because it&#39;s CUTTING BITS OFF OF BABIES. how fucked-up you gotta be to convince yourself there&#39;s nothing wrong with that? a newborn baby cannot consent to the surgery, cannot defend himself, and is stuck with the results for his entire life. you DO NOT perform unnecessary surgery on people without their consent, period - and it&#39;s especially repugnant to do it to a child.

secondarily, I wouldn&#39;t even be so violently opposed to the practise if there was any medical benefit to carrying it out, but the fact is that the consequences have no bearing whatsoever on health - and also deprive the recipient of sexually-valuable tissue and nerves. and that ain&#39;t my opinion; it&#39;s a physiological fact (every recognized medical authority on the planet states that circumcision is a last-ditch treatment for severe anatomical abnormality and/or perennial infection).

those are a couple reasons why people get "bent out of shape" about it, regardless of their own sexual habits. I&#39;m sure some of the circumcized guys on here can provide you with many more from their own perspectives, but what makes my head hurt is that anyone would want to try excusing something like neonatal circumcision in the first place.

 

[DC_DEEP]

Originally posted by prepstudinsc@Jul 8 2005, 07:17 AM
What I don&#39;t really understand is why straight men don&#39;t really seem to care one way or the other if they are cut, but gay guys get so emotional about this topic.
We have straight uncut guys and they state the facts as to how they feel, their experiences being uncut, problems they&#39;ve had, but for the most part it&#39;s just very matter of fact. No offense here, but the many of the gay men get all bent out of shape that they&#39;ve been mutilated, they didn&#39;t get a choice, their parents owe them an explanation as to why they did what they did, blah, blah, blah. The straight cut men for the most part all just seem to the be like, "it&#39;s cool that I&#39;m cut" or "I&#39;m glad that I&#39;m not cut" and that&#39;s the end of the story. Can someone explain to me why the gay guys seem to be more upset with being cut and wanting to stay uncut than the straight guys?

Please understand I&#39;m not gay bashing here, it&#39;s just that it seems that it is the way this thread seems to pan out and I&#39;m just trying to figure it out.

[post=327589]Quoted post[/post]​

Prep, my big deal in this sub-thread is not whether someone is cut or uncut. I would feel the same about parents getting large, garish PERMANENT tattoos on their days-old infant. My point is, I have a problem with parents who just simply cut off a part of their infant son, without his permission, because "everyone else does it" or "it&#39;s cleaner that way" or "we want him to be like his daddy". Would routinely cutting off any OTHER body part be considered mutilation?

 

[jonb]

Cutting bits off babies. That&#39;s all I need to know. Uncut and straight, but it&#39;s cutting bits off babies. And it&#39;s quackery. I wouldn&#39;t mind so much if it were something stupid, like giving someone magic water for a cold, but the claims of circumcision preventing HIV are a much deadlier form of medical fraud.

If you think it&#39;s a sexual thing, I can point out a story I read at BBC&#39;s site a while back about a pedophile ring busted in Glasgow where the videos included videos of circumcision.

 

[Mr._dB]

Originally posted by jonb@Jul 8 2005, 07:47 PM
Cutting bits off babies. That&#39;s all I need to know. Uncut and straight, but it&#39;s cutting bits off babies. And it&#39;s quackery. I wouldn&#39;t mind so much if it were something stupid, like giving someone magic water for a cold, but the claims of circumcision preventing HIV are a much deadlier form of medical fraud.

Ditto on all points.

I&#39;m heterosexual and I vehemently oppose circumcision.

 

[Mr._dB]

Originally posted by prepstudinsc@Jul 7 2005, 08:25 AM
Adam, the first man, was born circumcised which signified his closeness to God. Because Adam&#39;s sin was the failure of mankind the foreskin, symbolizing his new separation from God, became a permanent part of the human body.

Where in the scriptures is this written???

 

[jonb]

It isn&#39;t. In fact, from what I understand, circumcision&#39;s supposed to be a mark of Jewish identity. Of course, Genesis has two creation stories which contradict each other, so maybe a third one says Adam was circumcised. LOL

 

[godiluvabig1]

I just skimmed through this, and I am not even surprised that it turned to the Bible, lol...

On the original subject, the original post asked us women to reply as well... Personally, cut or uncut, a dick is a dick to me... Except for this one guy I dated who was uncut... He must not have kept it clean, cuz it was rank... It smelled like something crawled in his foreskin and died... We didn&#39;t do anything after I noticed that, we didn&#39;t even last long after that... go figure...

Like someone mentioned earlier about keeping teeth clean... I actually know people who measure others&#39; personal hygeine by their teeth... off subject, but I was reminded of that...

But, bottom line from me, I don&#39;t have a preference as long as the guy keeps himself clean, cuz I am very particular about keeping my vaginal area clean, so I wouldn&#39;t expect any less from a guy with his manhood...

 

[prepstudinsc]

Originally posted by Mr._dB@Jul 8 2005, 08:59 PM
Ditto on all points.

I&#39;m heterosexual and I vehemently oppose circumcision.

[post=327735]Quoted post[/post]​

Read my question...it was why the gay guys got all emotional about it and the straight people were matter of fact. Jonb stated facts and Mr dB made one statement that he was opposed, but both were rational in their approach. The gay uncut people are seemingly waging this war against the practice. I am cut and I&#39;m happy that I am. The straight cut people aren&#39;t out to circumcise the world or convert those who aren&#39;t, but the opposition camp seems to want to make us out to be freaks because we are ok with the fact that we were cut as babies.

 

[prepstudinsc]

I got that post off of a Jewish website. It went into all sorts of details about why they keep Kosher, why they circumcise, etc. It explained the cultural, religious and historical reasons for their traditions. I am a Christian, but knowing the Jewish traditions explain a lot of why we do things or why we don&#39;t have to do things anymore. Circumcision is just a cultural thing in the US--most people do it and because a handful of people are vehemently opposed to it being done to babies doesn&#39;t mean it&#39;s going to stop.

 

[Dr Rock]

Originally posted by gooseneck@Jul 9 2005, 07:02 AM
Cutting hair is cutting bits as well, Dr. Rock, so chill.

hair grows back, moron. go find yourself at least one clue before you try to tell ME anything.

At the time of birth, the decision is ultimately the parents&#39; because: 1. the baby can&#39;t decide for him/herself; the parents have been waiting and struggling (the mother) for 9 months and have earned the say-so.

uh ... no. if someone can&#39;t look after a kid properly they got no right to have one. it&#39;s a privilege, not a right - and if you abuse your privileges, you should forfeit them.

"correct the mutilation" caused by your parents who are put in your life as an authority over you.

nobody was "put in your life as an authority over you." only insecure cretins feel the need to exercise or subject themselves to authority. a parent&#39;s choice ends where their child&#39;s body begins, period. you do not perform unnecessary (and in this case IRREVERSIBLE) surgery on someone else without their consent, EVER. the fact that someone could do this to THEIR OWN CHILD makes my flesh crawl. parents are supposed to be responsible for their childrens&#39; SAFETY.

And I will more than likely circumcise my son b/c it&#39;s MY CHOICE AND RIGHT.

[post=327816]Quoted post[/post]​

pay attention to what&#39;s already been said, you ignorant shitcricket. it ain&#39;t your right and you clearly don&#39;t possess the mental faculties to make decisions for anyone else, let alone someone who can&#39;t protect themselves from your assaults. you do not have the choice to take out your own insecurities on a child, so find some other way to deal with them.

 

[robertomuro]

Thanks Dr Rock, you probably said it all better and more colourfully than I would have. You are unfortunately correct when you say that some people are just not worthy to be parents which is why many times the state does remove custody of the child from the parents. If the parents decided to cut off a different body part the state would probably intervene, unfortunately with the penis it still seems to be allowed.

If someone tied me down and cut off any of my body parts he would find a 9mm hollowpoint in his head at my first opportunity.

In many countries it is about to become illegal and many have highly regulared the practise essentually making it very difficult if not impossible to do. YEAH&#33;&#33;

In Europe, cirumcision is essentially unheard of and I have never heard a single person here asking to be circumcised. I doubt the women would be to impressed to find bits of a guys penis missing with a scar in its place here but as it is so rare I cant state that for certain.

To the few procircumcisers on this thread: What exact benefit are you under the illusion of obtaining from doing this to your son? 2nd Q: Would you do a partial circumcision to your daughter if your religion proclaimed it? (rhetorical question I guess).

 

[Dr Rock]

Originally posted by robertomuro@Jul 9 2005, 03:38 PM
In Europe, cirumcision is essentially unheard of and I have never heard a single person here asking to be circumcised. I doubt the women would be to impressed to find bits of a guys penis missing with a scar in its place here but as it is so rare I cant state that for certain.

[post=327880]Quoted post[/post]​

well, all except one of the women I&#39;ve ever happened to discuss the subject with did state that they preferred intact penises (and the one who didn&#39;t was a virgin - go figure), but I got the impression that it wasn&#39;t a really big deal to them anyway - I don&#39;t think there are many girls out there who&#39;d actually refuse to have sex with a guy they liked just cos he was circumcized.

as I pointed out in another thread on this subject, most of the guys from jewish families I&#39;ve known in the UK and europe were not circumcized - in fact of the only two I have met who were, one was from an orthodox jewish family and the other was vociferously unhappy about it. I think most jews (outside of israel and the US, anyway) have long since realized that it&#39;s an outdated, unnecessary custom with no real relevance to them or their faith. as one jewish lady I know put it, "we got enough shit to deal with already without cutting up our sons&#39; penises as well."

 

[jonb]

But unlike diapers, haircuts, and the like, circumcision will be with the boy for the rest of his life. gooseneck&#39;s same argument can be used to justify clitoridectomy.