Gay Expectations: Anonymous Poll

[deleted3995701]

After years in tiny nowhere town, I came out and was the talk of the town for awhile. It was good and shit times but the hate got t be to much and opportunity was there so I moved to the city.

(Ignoring all aspects of my ex for this) At first it was weird, then I met other gays at the gay bar including my fairy godfather (who saved me from some shit) and drag queens.

From there I got into raves and met more gays and finally the heavy drug scene and met even more gay guys.

I'd have to break each group into subsets but even with my wide base of gay lifestyles known, I never found my tribe.

Everything I thought I knew about gays was wrong and I figured out that the scenes I found weren't for me. This was really disheartening.

All the dudes I like are porn stars and the sad thing about that is porn stars aren't real people. They're actors playing a role.

I've been away from anything that could be considered mainstream 'gay' life. I have no gay districts near me, no gay groups or social activities and not a single gay friend even after all the years I was in the city.

So the concept of gay life was filled with disappointment for me and still is.

 

[jpk338]

Tragic really! Sorry to hear about your friend’s murder

If your friend were young, white with model good looks. You bet your ass the so called gay community would bring their circuit party (with 5000 strong muscle marys in leather thongs) down to the rally.

I hate to disillusion you ,but my friend was 22 yrs old, cute as a button, and very popular gymnast. The gay people here were afraid back in 1995. It's a little better now, but not much.

 

[BussyPhilipps]

I hate to disillusion you ,but my friend was 22 yrs old, cute as a button, and very popular gymnast. The gay people here were afraid back in 1995. It's a little better now, but not much.

Were the gay people who wouldn’t show up openly gay? Because if they weren’t publicly out, that might explain why they didn’t show up.

 

[jpk338]

Were the gay people who wouldn’t show up openly gay? Because if they weren’t publicly out, that might explain why they didn’t show up.

Yes they were. I'm talking about Ft.lauderdale and Palm beach county.

 

[emmyfan]

Interesting insight about the horrible treatment that black drag queens faced in Chicago

 

[malakos]

You’ve never heard of Aaron Schock? Do you live under a rock?

Some days I wish I did. But no, not at all. I just don't concern myself with any of the sort of cultural mediums that would make one aware of these sorts of personalities.

 

[BussyPhilipps]

Some days I wish I did. But no, not at all. I just don't concern myself with any of the sort of cultural mediums that would make one aware of these sorts of personalities.

He was a Republican member of the U.S. House of Representatives. He’s infamous for having been a proponent of anti-LGBTQ+ laws while in congress, even though lots of people suspected he was gay. And then he showed up at Coachella a couple of years ago with a bunch of shirtless white, muscular gay men, and a video leaked of him making out with one of them and putting his hand done their pants. And then nude vids and pics leaked, and he has been traveling the world with gay escorts and Insta thots ever since.

The gays who associate with him are despicable. He has never even apologized and/or tried to make amends for all of the anti-LGBTQ+ legislation he tried to push while in congress. And he attended a Trump fundraiser last February or early March. But he’s hot, white and muscular, and that’s all many white gays care about.

 

[osid]

I’m guessing you don’t believe in the adage that there’s no such thing as a dumb question.

Is it really a question if its purpose is to push a personal agenda rather than to impartially seek information?

 

[BussyPhilipps]

Is it really a question if its purpose is to push a personal agenda rather than to impartially seek information?

How do you know its purpose was to push a personal agenda? That’s an assumption you made about that member’s question.

 

[osid]

How do you know its purpose was to push a personal agenda? That’s an assumption you made about that member’s question.

Based on experience, any time any one asks that question, it's because they have an ax to grind. As mentioned above, there is no such thing as a monolithic "gay community", so people asking about it obviously have preconceived notions about what it is or should be.

 

[BussyPhilipps]

Based on experience, any time any one asks that question, it's because they have an ax to grind. As mentioned above, there is no such thing as a monolithic "gay community", so people asking about it obviously have preconceived notions about what it is or should be.

There is a gay community, just like there’s a Black community, an Asian community, a Jewish community, etc. They’re not monoliths because there are many different factions and sub-groups, but they’re still communities. For example, right now the Asian American community has come together to call for an end to Anti-Asian hate and racism. There are many different Asian ethnicities, but in this case, they’re all effected by the same thing. People committing anti-Asian hate crimes aren’t differentiating between ethnicities. Thus, they’re a community.

 

[osid]

There is a gay community, just like there’s a Black community, an Asian community, a Jewish community, etc. They’re not monoliths because there are many different factions and sub-groups, but they’re still communities. For example, right now the Asian American community has come together to call for an end to Anti-Asian hate and racism. There are many different Asian ethnicities, but in this case, they’re all effected by the same thing. People committing anti-Asian hate crimes aren’t differentiating between ethnicities. Thus, they’re a community.

That's my point exactly. So what subset of a very diverse gay community is the question about? It's interesting reading all the responses because everyone seems to be focused on the plastic/influencer/circuit segments of the gay community rather than any other faction. But focusing on one small subset of a diverse community is like assuming that Kim Kardashian is representative of all Armenian-Americans or that Rachel Hollis is representative of all white women. When people focus on a shallow and self-involved subset of a community and then come away disappointed, why are they casting blame on the "gay community"? Their beef is with circuit culture and the instathots that perpetrate it, not those of us who decide to define our community based on real connections.

 

[BussyPhilipps]

That's my point exactly. So what subset of a very diverse gay community is the question about? It's interesting reading all the responses because everyone seems to be focused on the plastic/influencer/circuit segments of the gay community rather than any other faction. But focusing on one small subset of a diverse community is like assuming that Kim Kardashian is representative of all Armenian-Americans or that Rachel Hollis is representative of all white women. When people focus on a shallow and self-involved subset of a community and then come away disappointed, why are they casting blame on the "gay community"? Their beef is with circuit culture and the instathots that perpetrate it, not those of us who decide to define our community based on real connections.

Well, if you look at gay advertising, gay publications, gay representation in the media, etc., it’s mostly white, attractive, muscular guys. And dating and hook-up apps are a sea of shirtless, buff torsos with stuff like “masc only,” “masc4masc,” “No fems,” “No fatties,” “white only,” “Not into Black dudes,” “No Asians,” etc., as well as guys wanting to party and do drugs like crystal meth.

 

[osid]

Well, if you look at gay advertising, gay publications, gay representation in the media, etc., it’s mostly white, attractive, muscular guys. And dating and hook-up apps are a sea of shirtless, buff torsos with stuff like “masc only,” “masc4masc,” “No fems,” “No fatties,” “white only,” “Not into Black dudes,” “No Asians,” etc., as well as guys wanting to party and do drugs like crystal meth.

If you're looking to the media or to hook-up apps for "community", not only are you looking in all the wrong places, but you're setting yourself up for bitter disappointment. That's on you.

 

[7053701]

This is a dumb question. First, there is no monolithic "gay community". It's not like there are memberships cards or anything. Second, putting expectations on others, no matter who they are, is always going to lead to disappointment. So yes, the "gay community" has lived up to my expectations because I have not put any expectations on "it".

I get the distinct impression that the OP has his own unmet expectations, and that he is posing the question to validate his own view of how the mythical "gay community" is unsatisfactory.

I was going to reply to this thread, but you summed it up perfectly.

 

[malakos]

He was a Republican member of the U.S. House of Representatives. He’s infamous for having been a proponent of anti-LGBTQ+ laws while in congress, even though lots of people suspected he was gay. And then he showed up at Coachella a couple of years ago with a bunch of shirtless white, muscular gay men, and a video leaked of him making out with one of them and putting his hand done their pants. And then nude vids and pics leaked, and he has been traveling the world with gay escorts and Insta thots ever since.

The gays who associate with him are despicable. He has never even apologized and/or tried to make amends for all of the anti-LGBTQ+ legislation he tried to push while in congress. And he attended a Trump fundraiser last February or early March. But he’s hot, white and muscular, and that’s all many white gays care about.

Why did you bother writing that? I indicated in my last response that I don't care about this kind of stuff.

 

[top2playnlalb]

I've always been a bit of a Gertrude (the pretty girl's friend) and have never really fit in with the gay society. Though I became active in the 80s and spent my time in Los Angeles I've always been somewhat invisible, if someone looks at me it's because they are looking through me at someone else. I'm not bitter about it, I've lived longer than most of those who had lots of opportunities to be promiscuous. But I've only been in one relationship a he died in '93.
I'm finding it sad that the new generation, such a fucking Ayn Rand generation, selfish and self-centered as fuck, is following in the same superficial footsteps as they were in my generation. Only now it's all about how much someone can make wagging their weenie on TikTok or teasing with thirst trap and they are making buck, but what type of future is that giving people where it's all beauty and body and the first sign of wrinkle, a surgery, a scar, anything that takes from their beauty puts them in the Gertrude group and they lose attention and don't learn to settle for less than they used to be able to get.
I'm disappointed with the community but it's always been a superficial one, at least in the bigger cities.

 

[LICNYCgay]

This is a dumb question. First, there is no monolithic "gay community". It's not like there are memberships cards or anything. Second, putting expectations on others, no matter who they are, is always going to lead to disappointment. So yes, the "gay community" has lived up to my expectations because I have not put any expectations on "it".

I get the distinct impression that the OP has his own unmet expectations, and that he is posing the question to validate his own view of how the mythical "gay community" is unsatisfactory.

…you didn’t get your membership card?

 

[osid]

…you didn’t get your membership card?

It must have gotten lost in the mail. The postal service has really gone downhill

 

[deleted955030]

Though I concur there is no monolithic “gay community,” there is definitely a plethora of anecdotal evidence and research that shows race and colorism affects all groups within it. We do not have to be a united front for this same issue to surface everywhere. Now, you can ask a representative set of people from each diverse group in the “gay community,” and by far, not just a majority, but more than what is needed for a bill to pass the house and senate will be more likely to show the greatest preference for white/light skin men over every other race, color, ethnicity, etc., across the board. In fact, gay POCs tend to rate other gay POCs even those of the same grouping lower in attraction, no different than white men by large who do not find POCs attractive unless they fit a very rigidly defined stereotype that aligns with some white gay man fantasy and who will then be tossed aside after fulfilling said societally reaffirmed expectation of them. This is not a coincidence! This is also not just because everybody came together as distinct groups and decided white men were of superior attractiveness. No, this belief was heavily influenced and shaped by European/white centric standards. In this regard, my disappointment in this does not come from a preconceived notion, but in fact from the overwhelming amount of gay people who pushed for inclusion and acceptance in greater society to then create and support a gay micro society, that is in fact, not very inclusive or reaffirming of those not considered the status quo. Though, honestly, I cannot say I am surprised. Most people, in fact, do not want fairness, or equality, or even equity, as much as they want power, or to be in a grouping that is in a position of power.

Femininity, by large in the “gay community,” has always and continues to be seen as a scourge by many because sexual premium is placed on being masculine, even on what could be considered as “toxic masculinity,” to the detriment of gay men. Why? Ultimately, because gay men by and large questioned and continue to question their masculinity because it was communicated to them by straight and straight-acting affirming men, family, society, government, etc., that to be a man meant they had to be of the utmost masculine. So, a system had to be derived for them to reaffirm their masculinity. In fact, it is for this very reason that outside of some selected niches like twinks and Dad n Son (where in which it is the malleability of the twink, son, etc., and his being groomed that is the highlight), which guys grow out of because we all age, and the rise of amateur, that bottoms in porn had to take on a more masculine persona as they aged. Hell, even despite that because bottoms are “the receivers” to be destroyed, ruined, etc., by more masculine men - hence why it was seen as necessary for bottoms themselves to become more masculine, many studios do not even pay bottoms the same price as tops because ultimately them being “the receiver” they are still often seen like women, as feminine. Also, not surprised by this either. Like an oppressor, it is often that the oppressed become oppressors themselves to mask their insecurity.

Now, I am not advocating anybody to take that as me pushing for anybody to start to date a feminine or POC man if they are not to your liking. However, when the majority of socialization and indoctrination for gay men into “sexual hood” (for a lack of better phrasing) is pornography (as it has been since gay porn has been a thing) that is reinforced and affirmed by its inclusion it gay spaces, there is something to be said about when fantasy meets reality. That, “oh, it’s just a fantasy” isn’t a fantasy when you reinforced it in reality. It becomes a status quo.