"bbc", "mandingo", Is It Racial Fetishization Of Black Men?

[raceplay]

As a Dom I sometimes play a character where I "train guys on Diversity and Inclusion". Something a few of my White Subs have said to me made me realize something interesting... They said they learned more about real world racism by having sex with me than they did growing up in a traditional classroom setting.

At first I was confused because that's kind of sad, but then I realized that the bedroom is the only place that they've ever felt comfortable having deeper discussions about Race. The bedroom may also be their first real connection with a black person.

This poses the question - is what we're doing really raceplay if what I'm "educating" them on is actually true?

 

[HorseHung40's]

If YOU feel that a show or other event depicts a person or group of persons in a demeaning, unflattering or offensive manner, don't watch it.

If someone wishes to discuss that show, thus making you uncomfortable, change the topic - maybe with an explanation, if needed.

Be your own censor.

 

[HOU_HEADHUNTER]

If YOU feel that a show or other event depicts a person or group of persons in a demeaning, unflattering or offensive manner, don't watch it.

That's an obvious answer when gaslighting. I'm black and me sitting back watching my people be stereotyped and demeaned is not my choice. I'd rather inform the misinformed about the problematic nature of such depictions. I'm invested because I am a black man and it does affect me. Basically what you just told me and others who are talking about it is to shut up and just deal with it. Let me make an example so that you could somehow relate to why such imagery is not cool. Let's say the porn industry started to produce porn that depicted white men as Nazis and it became very popular to the point that this is how most porn started to showcase white men. Would you be okay with that if it started to creep into your own personal dating experiences? If you really want to understand deeper then start reading on the subject. I have a great book that you can begin with called "The Delectable Negro" by Vincent Woodard. He goes into detail about how the fetishization of black men started as early as when Europeans started crossing the sea and collecting bodies over in Africa.

Be your own censor.

I can be my own censor but that does nothing in regards of getting the conversation started and helping people to change their mind process. So many have been brainwashed by what they see in porn.

 

[HorseHung40's]

That's an obvious answer when gaslighting. I'm black and me sitting back watching my people be stereotyped and demeaned is not my choice. I'd rather inform the misinformed about the problematic nature of such depictions. I'm invested because I am a black man and it does affect me. Basically what you just told me and others who are talking about it is to shut up and just deal with it. Let me make an example so that you could somehow relate to why such imagery is not cool. Let's say the porn industry started to produce porn that depicted white men as Nazis and it became very popular to the point that this is how most porn started to showcase white men. Would you be okay with that if it started to creep into your own personal dating experiences? If you really want to understand deeper then start reading on the subject. I have a great book that you can begin with called "The Delectable Negro" by Vincent Woodard. He goes into detail about how the fetishization of black men started as early as when Europeans started crossing the sea and collecting bodies over in Africa.


I can be my own censor but that does nothing in regards of getting the conversation started and helping people to change their mind process. So many have been brainwashed by what they see in porn.

Your points are extremely valid! Thank you. Have you contacted the sponsors and makers of this production to say that you will organize a boycott of their products for having helped produce this? Without money, these groups cannot fund hateful
drivel.

 

[Donismon]

If YOU feel that a show or other event depicts a person or group of persons in a demeaning, unflattering or offensive manner, don't watch it.

If someone wishes to discuss that show, thus making you uncomfortable, change the topic - maybe with an explanation, if needed.

Be your own censor.

“Be your own sensor.”

That is one of the greatest comments ever on the internet. Personal responsibility—something many people lack.

Thank you for that comment.

 

[Donismon]

Your points are extremely valid! Thank you. Have you contacted the sponsors and makers of this production to say that you will organize a boycott of their products for having helped produce this? Without money, these groups cannot fund hateful
drivel.

Love this comment, too!

 

[HOU_HEADHUNTER]

Your points are extremely valid! Thank you. Have you contacted the sponsors and makers of this production to say that you will organize a boycott of their products for having helped produce this? Without money, these groups cannot fund hateful
drivel.

First of all porn is not regulated and I'm speaking in general. I'm not speaking of any particular production. I know I can censor what I see but I don't want to. I want to educate people such as you that don't care because it doesn't affect you but it affects me and men that look like me. I'm sure you are smart enough to know that mainstream porn makes porn that appeals to certain demographics. The type of porn that I have an issue with is popular not because black people are buying it so what does that tell you. It makes money so do you think the producers of porn care that a few black men hate the imagery in which they are being promoted to the world? Again I'll try to make it easy for you to digest and relate. Imagine white men being presented as Nazis and this crossing over into how people perceived white men to be in real life. Imagine those perceptions of who white men are entering into your personal life somehow. Would you sit back and allow it?

 

[Jeffer2580]

It is definitely dehumanizing and fetishizing..But I think the BBC mythos is especially damaging to Black men, because unlike other forms of racial fetishism, it has intersectionality with some of the competitive aspects of masculinity;almost a facade of pedestalization. It masquerades itself as a position of strength and dominance, placing black men on a sexual hierarchy atop all others while simultaneously regressing us to sex dolls in employ of (usually) white owners. Especially the hetero sense, because there still persists a historical anxiety amongst European derived male populations as to the "sanctity" of white female sexual access, that I think a lot if black men lean into, to their own ruin.

It is definitely dehumanizing and fetishizing..But I think the BBC mythos is especially damaging to Black men, because unlike other forms of racial fetishism, it has intersectionality with some of the competitive aspects of masculinity;almost a facade of pedestalization. It masquerades itself as a position of strength and dominance, placing black men on a sexual hierarchy atop all others while simultaneously regressing us to sex dolls in employ of (usually) white owners. Especially the hetero sense, because there still persists a historical anxiety amongst European derived male populations as to the "sanctity" of white female sexual access, that I think a lot if black men lean into, to their own ruin.

The bolded is exactly the comment I was looking for. Black men are apportioning blames but we also have a part to play in our own dehumanization. Apparently, it's one of the downsides of porn, it's just sick and completely racist to both white and black men because we are taking either sides as a monolith

 

[Jeffer2580]

Aren't most physical attractions, as opposed to emotional attractions, fetishes? Tall man fetish, muscle fetish, big dick fetish, red-head fetish, uncut cock fetish, etc.

This is a solid debate that we all try to sweep under the rug as our biases towards attractions won't let us have it. I've been thinking about opening a thread for every type of physical attraction biases that don't stem from racial dehumanization

 

[heinz.friedrich]

The bolded is exactly the comment I was looking for. Black men are apportioning blames but we also have a part to play in our own dehumanization. Apparently, it's one of the downsides of porn, it's just sick and completely racist to both white and black men because we are taking either sides as a monolith

This is a solid debate that we all try to sweep under the rug as our biases towards attractions won't let us have it. I've been thinking about opening a thread for every type of physical attraction biases that don't stem from racial dehumanization

That reminds me of some people that claim it is not racist, if you dehumanize every race equally. I think it does not matter how you call something (racist or big cock fetish or something else). What counts is what you feel during the arousal. Only you can know if you dehumanize the other person.

I think there is the same probability by gay men as by straight men to dehumanize the gender that they are attracted to. There was the metoo movement for straight males that are harrassing women and there should be a similar movement for gay men.

Aren't most physical attractions, as opposed to emotional attractions, fetishes? Tall man fetish, muscle fetish, big dick fetish, red-head fetish, uncut cock fetish, etc.

@Jeffer2580
There is usually a trigger for arousal, in my opinion. That can be different things. I think the word fetish and dehumanization is misleading. You can be aroused by only Black men and still not fetishizing them for their skin color. That is the case when you love and respect them. But you have this trigger or bias in you that only arouses you to certain biases. I hope that is understandable. I am not a native English speaker.
I think that a person has no biases is seldom.

It is often that the passive part is dehumanized (inferior) and the active part is the master (superior). All sex postions should be seen as equals then it is positive sex, in my opinion.

 

[NotAfraidofHeights]

Its no different than people thinking im good
In bed bc of my latin heritage. Or expect that my body is shapely.

 

[Donismon]

This is a solid debate that we all try to sweep under the rug as our biases towards attractions won't let us have it. I've been thinking about opening a thread for every type of physical attraction biases that don't stem from racial dehumanization

I wouldn’t call them biases. I don’t understand this obsession with demeaning people for their attraction. On an evolutionary scale, human attraction is what leads to reproduction. Even in the animal kingdom male animals have the “show off” in order to attract a mate. Certain features attract certain individuals; environment has a lot to do with this.

Humans are so diverse and based on our geographic origins, we have phenotypes that complement those origins.

Some people won’t be happy until all humans are one color, one height, and one dick size. And some people in this thread look at European features as the default, and think it’s only fair if other people races/ethnicities model after that.

The fact that there are people are overusing the term fetish in response to people admiring non-European phenotypes is insane.

 

[Sagittarius84]

The bolded is exactly the comment I was looking for. Black men are apportioning blames but we also have a part to play in our own dehumanization. Apparently, it's one of the downsides of porn, it's just sick and completely racist to both white and black men because we are taking either sides as a monolith

I think the persistent issue is how intertwined with legitimate reasoning and moral objectivity fetishism can be. To look at a white woman's desire for a black man as a partner, it may have some sexual overtones to it, but a lot if times we don't know if this BBC fetishism or a genuine desire based response to a section of men whom tend to be more emotionally involved fathers, and operate more amicably in spaces where women wield authority and power. Black men are constantly told(typically by the women in our lives) any attraction to a woman that doesn't resemble your mother or sister is colonized indoctrination, wherein a lot of Black men may be more positively receptive to women whom do not hold such a hypermasculine ideal of men's attractiveness, and are more forthcoming and enthusiastic with physical attraction.
I think things like these are why, where I am in no way triggered by convos of racial fetishism, I can empathize with the reactions of people whom are, because of the very legitimate intersectionalities intertwined within a person's desicion or desire to date or mate within or outside their race.

 

[NotAfraidofHeights]

Black men dont date black women because they act like men. What?? All the black men Ive dated have said this exact thing to me. Most black men seem to really hate black women actually. I mean I have dated black men who made fun of black women wearing weaves and wigs.

Nobody thinks Black Man when they think emotionally involved father. What???

This is delusional…

 

[Sagittarius84]

Black men dont date black women because they act like men. What??

I never said that. If you were getting that from the "hypermasculine ideal" comment then you misread. What I was saying has much more to do with whom black women will enthusiastically mate and date with then anything about black men.

Most black men seem to really hate black women actually. I mean I have dated black men who made fun of black women wearing weaves and wigs.

Is that most black men or the black men that you will pay attention to?

Nobody thinks Black Man when they think emotionally involved father. What???

I understand what society has spoken about the fatherhood potential of black men, I don't deny that, I'm speaking more along statistical means as in the parental effectiveness per time spent with child, especially in comparison to maternal involvement. I'm not making judgment, just an observation that in general the children of single black fathers, often with less state and community support and incentives given to them, do quite a bit better than the children of single black mothers.
I live in what could be referred to as a mini MAGA verse, lots of white homogeny going on here. My daughter's high school is predominantly white, with a highly disproportionate # of black stepfathers. I don't think it's a coincidence that when socioeconomics are no longer a concern for many divorced white women, and they're looking for viable relationship partners and emotionally available parenting they seek black men. Is there any possibility that there's skepticism at play, because despite the black woman's unfortunate "mammy" stereotyping and the Western tradition of black women as the caretakers of white children, that non black men largely are not looking to black women to birth their children, but are typically content to fetishize them and not much else?

Most black men seem to really hate black women actually.

Most black men are raised in single mother households unfortunately...again no judgements at play here but could you posit on any level why generations of women with unilateral control of the molding of young men produce young men that don't seem to like them very much? Are you so invested in the thought that black men just don't like black women that you don't allow for any possibility of the way black girls women treat, mate and date black boys and men incurs any consequences? Would you be willing to bet that the average black man that black women find to be an attractive prospect gives two shits about her and her well being?

 

[Sagittarius84]

This is delusional…

One could also argue this outright dismissal and misinterpretation of objective issues so present amongst the women in our communities, both collective and individual, tend to leave black men susceptible to the subtle fetishism from women of other races as they often masquerade as a worth and appreciation not felt homogenously.

 

[HOU_HEADHUNTER]

I'm loving the comments that are being shared. Great to hear different perspectives. Even those that are far off base in thinking that not wanting to be fetishized by white people is black people wanting acceptance from white people. I still don't get how that is even surmised from the topic at hand. I do think there is something to be said about black men that find reasons to hate black women and use it as their excuse to look outside of their race for a partner. I think self hatred is rampant in the black community for obvious reasons. People don't like to talk about it but it's the very reason why colorism is a think within the black community. The desire to be closer to whiteness even if it means finding a partner that is closer is apart of the agenda that has been promoted since the beginning. There are only a few that can recognize it in all of it's forms. When I hear black people fetishizing black children for having certain features like light colored eyes, or loose textured hair, I cringe and try to make them understand that what they are doing is apart of anti-blackness. I experienced it as a child due to my hair texture. Always getting compliments from black people because my hair is not kinky. I didn't get it then but once I educated myself I came to despise any mention of hair texture that was wielded my way. I love my African features and therefore I find those features most attractive in others because of that.

 

[Sagittarius84]

I do think there is something to be said about black men that find reasons to hate black women and use it as their excuse to look outside of their race for a partner.

I don't think this is as much of a thing as it's divisively made out to be, at least as much as the whole "divest" movement exists amongst black women, who prefer black male partners above all over 90% of the time. I think what happens is like most male populations, they adapt to mating and dating conditions and find an increased number of non white women attracted to them. Many of these men find themselves either unable to attract women that look them, or have gotten to a socioeconomic level where women that look them aren't as present. In either case their opinion of black women is formed by their largely homogeneous and unilateral experience growing up around them. Most black boys raised in black neighborhoods in some manner of a two or more parent household make their efforts to date and marry black girls. If black girls don't like them, they might go otherwise, a broken home with a toxic matriarchal and gynocentric structure at play, could also yield the same results.
I don't doubt resentment may generate hateful retorts from a select population of black men, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find a young black boy whose 1st choice isn't some manner of black woman.

 

[HOU_HEADHUNTER]

I don't think this is as much of a thing as it's divisively made out to be, at least as much as the whole "divest" movement exists amongst black women, who prefer black male partners above all over 90% of the time. I think what happens is like most male populations, they adapt to mating and dating conditions and find an increased number of non white women attracted to them. Many of these men find themselves either unable to attract women that look them, or have gotten to a socioeconomic level where women that look them aren't as present. In either case their opinion of black women is formed by their largely homogeneous and unilateral experience growing up around them. Most black boys raised in black neighborhoods in some manner of a two or more parent household make their efforts to date and marry black girls. If black girls don't like them, they might go otherwise, a broken home with a toxic matriarchal and gynocentric structure at play, could also yield the same results.
I don't doubt resentment may generate hateful retorts from a select population of black men, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find a young black boy whose 1st choice isn't some manner of black woman.

Why isn't it equal across the board? Black women are raised in these same conditions but don't seem to want to look outside for a partner. Also why isn't this common in other racial groups on such a large scale with maybe the exception for Asian females?

 

[HOU_HEADHUNTER]

Black men dont date black women because they act like men. What?? All the black men Ive dated have said this exact thing to me. Most black men seem to really hate black women actually. I mean I have dated black men who made fun of black women wearing weaves and wigs.

Nobody thinks Black Man when they think emotionally involved father. What???

This is delusional…

Are you even black? This sounds absurd. Yea there are black men with deep rooted mommy issues but to say that "most" black men really hate black women is crazy. You have dated a few self hating black guys if anything. Right now you are coming across like a gay white man that envies black women which is another issue I have with gay white men who try to do their best imitation of what they believe to be the "Sassy black woman" in order to try to win the attention of black men. I actually checked a white guy that hung with me for coming around me doing the sassy black woman act but when he's in the company of others he's back to being white without all of the "extra." Needless to say this was a white man that had a strong fetish for black men and he'd go in and out of the act whenever he was around certain people.