Did you "choose" to be gay?

[chrisrobin]

May have said it before but for many it is not a matter of if you chose to be gay but a matter of when and if you chose to embrace the fact that you are gay.

I'm a firm believer that gay people are born gay. Some choose not to embrace it and some do. I did not choose it for years but now I have. Many went down that path I'm sure.

There have been many before you who have resisted and gone on to lead unhappy lives unfulfilled.
We live in enlightened times - for the most part - and being "normal" is no longer a requisite for living a happy life.
I know of several guys who bowed to peer pressure, went down the path of marriage and children and regretted it every day - however to the outside world they were behaving as they should.
When the shit did hit the fan and, as it were, it all came out the result was a disaster for the now ex wife, the children who viewed the father from the perspective of the mother, and so, for the price of living life as they wanted they continued to live with guilt.

 

[HOU_HEADHUNTER]

I didn't choose to be gay. I often tell people I can't control what makes my dick hard and I don't think any red blooded man is in control of that. The only thing that i have a choice in is the choice to act on that arousal.

 

[dards44]

I don't believe that people are still asking the question.

 

[woodshed775]

I'm 18 and gay, just came out and I this question has irked me since middle school. Did any of you actually choose to be gay? I'm not asking about whether or not you chose to come out or express youself as gay, I'm asking about whether or not you chose to be attracted to other men. It would boggle me if anyone would. I'm all for pride, but who would want to be a part of a minority struggling to fit in?

I knew I was gay at a young age, and probably bi to be honest. This was in the early 70's so it was easier to contemplate than it might have been in earlier generations. Women's Lib , Gay Liberation, all manner of new thought, and the Hippies, were everywhere.

I have this interviewer who I think makes the best case for leaving people to their own nature.
I think he is right on point:

I don't know who the interviewer is, but in the responses I'm seeing the reality become clear of other people and their orientation being just the same as ourselves. Where borderline homophobes have the truth dawn on them as we watch.

I find it very moving.

 

[Smaccoms]

I knew I was gay at at a young age, and probably bi to be honest. This was in the early 70's so it was easier to contemplate than it might have been in earlier generations. Women's Lib , Gay Liberation, all manner of new thought, and the Hippies, were everywhere.

I have this interviewer who I think makes the best case for leaving people to their own nature.
I think he is right on point:
View attachment 79322191

I don't know who the interviewer is, but in the responses I'm seeing the reality become clear of other people and their orientation being just the same as ourselves. Where borderline homophobes have the truth dawn on them as we watch.

I find it very moving.

While I appreciate the video, most people don't think deeply about anything, do they?? That doesn't necessarily make it natural or a good thing. I believe a sex drive is innate...something we are born with. Yet when it comes to sexual orientation, I think people are railroaded into choosing one extreme or the other. It's a cultural phenomenon. Not a natural one.

To only find members of one sex or another sexually appealing is a learned behavior in my opinion. That's generally not how sex drives work. From my experience anyway.

It seems to me most animals on this planet engage in sexual relations with individuals they are attracted to regardless of gender or sex. It's sort of a non-issue. And that the relationship is mostly composed on their compatibility in general. Just my 2 cents.

I always knew I prefer men by the way. It took me till my mid-twenties to accept that I'm not gay however. I'm bisexual.

 

[deleted1074483]

To only find members of one sex or another sexually appealing is a learned behavior in my opinion. That's generally not how sex drives work. From my experience anyway.

and for a great many of us i'm sure we'd disagree that it is a learned behaviour!! I was born in the 60s in rural england and there were NO gay icons, movie stars, mentions, publications, it wasn't something talked about or really known about, etc, that were available to me, so i had no-one or nothing to learn from that i was gay other than that slow realisation i was very different to my male counterparts.

Sex drives are not a learned thing, they are a natural born instinct in us all and each differently I'm sure.

to have sex with someone, personally, i have to find them sexually appealing and attractive to me - i think many women can be extremely beautiful and attractive, but sexually? nothing there for me and i'm sure countless others.

from my experience and those of people i know, anyway ;-)

 

[chpoof]

To only find members of one sex or another sexually appealing is a learned behavior in my opinion. That's generally not how sex drives work. From my experience anyway.

So because this is your experience, that's the way it should work for everybody? Seriously? That total self-absorption.

In no way whatsoever did I "learn" to be exclusively sexually attracted to males and not females, nor was I "railroaded" into feeling like I had to choose one over the other. Guys turn me on; gals do not. It's as much a natural part of who I am as your own bisexuality is a natural part of who you are.

 

[chpoof]

FWIW, I received far more pressure to be bisexual after I came out as gay. This, I believe, is the cultural pressure. Most people cannot seem to wrap their head around a person not being sexually attracted to women in some way.

 

[Smaccoms]

and for a great many of us i'm sure we'd disagree that it is a learned behaviour!! I was born in the 60s in rural england and there were NO gay icons, movie stars, mentions, publications, it wasn't something talked about or really known about, etc, that were available to me, so i had no-one or nothing to learn from that i was gay other than that slow realisation i was very different to my male counterparts.

Sex drives are not a learned thing, they are a natural born instinct in us all and each differently I'm sure.

to have sex with someone, personally, i have to find them sexually appealing and attractive to me - i think many women can be extremely beautiful and attractive, but sexually? nothing there for me and i'm sure countless others.

from my experience and those of people i know, anyway ;-)

In my post you responded to, I also state that a sex drive is a natural and innate thing we are born with. You state this "sex drive is natural" argument in your response as though I had written otherwise. When I did not.

I'm trying to draw a distinction between sex drive and sexual orientation. I think the two are different things, with overlap of course...sort of a venn diagram situation. I think people are born with a drive toward sexual relations yes, but not with a specific image of what to be driven toward.

We were clearly born into different times and different cultures. And I think that's really cool

 

[woodshed775]

I'm 18 and gay, just came out and this question has irked me since middle school. Did any of you actually choose to be gay? I'm not asking about whether or not you chose to come out or express yourself as gay, I'm asking about whether or not you chose to be attracted to other men. It would boggle me if anyone would. I'm all for pride, but who would want to be a part of a minority struggling to fit in?

Hello Dustin, I hope you are doing well, you haven't been seen here in a while.

"It would boggle me if anyone would. I'm all for pride, but who would want to be a part of a minority struggling to fit in?"

This Man, John Howard Griffin, wanted to find out what Black Americans experienced in the Land of the Free.

He had already served in the Pacific in WW II, where he was paralyzed for a year with spinal meningitis, and later injured by a bomb blast. A year later he lost his vision entirely. In 1957 his vision returned. ( after eleven years ! )

Born and raised in Dallas, Texas.

from wikipedia:
Awarded a musical scholarship, he went to France to study French language and literature at the University of Poitiers and medicine at the École de Médecine. At 19, he joined the French Resistance as a medic, working at the Atlantic seaport of Saint-Nazaire, where he helped smuggle Austrian Jews to safety and freedom in England.

Griffin returned to the United States and enlisted, serving 39 months in the United States Army Air Forces stationed in the South Pacific, during which he was decorated for bravery.

It is fair to say that John Howard Griffin was a man of uncommon bravery and character. Way ahead of his fellow citizens in thinking Black Lives Matter.

In the fall of 1959, Griffin decided to investigate firsthand the plight of African Americans in the South, where racial segregation was legal; blacks had been disenfranchised since the turn of the century and closed out of the political system, and whites were struggling to maintain dominance against an increasing civil rights movement.

Griffin consulted a New Orleans dermatologist for aid in darkening his skin, being treated with a course of drugs, sunlamp treatments, and skin creams. Griffin shaved his head in order to hide his straight hair. He spent six weeks travelling as a black man in New Orleans and parts of Mississippi (with side trips to South Carolina and Georgia), getting around mainly by bus and by hitchhiking. He was later accompanied by a photographer who documented the trip, and the project was underwritten by Sepia magazine, in exchange for first publication rights for the articles he planned to write. These were published under the title Journey into Shame. When he decided to end his journey, in Montgomery, Alabama, he spent three days secluded in a hotel room to avoid the sunlight and stopped taking his skin-darkening medication.[8]

Griffin published an expanded version of his project as Black Like Me (1961), which became a best seller in 1961. He described in detail the problems an African American encountered in the segregated Deep South meeting the needs for food, shelter, and toilet and other sanitary facilities. Griffin also described the hatred he often felt from white Southerners he encountered in his daily life—shop clerks, ticket sellers, bus drivers, and others. He was particularly shocked by the curiosity white men displayed about his sexual life. He also included anecdotes about white Southerners who were friendly and helpful.

Still waiting...

Talk about walking a mile in another man's shoes...

His biography is enough to shame an ordinary man. ( me )

“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”
-Ian Maclaran

 

[Smaccoms]

So because this is your experience, that's the way it should work for everybody? Seriously? That total self-absorption.

In no way whatsoever did I "learn" to be exclusively sexually attracted to males and not females, nor was I "railroaded" into feeling like I had to choose one over the other. Guys turn me on; gals do not. It's as much a natural part of who I am as your own bisexuality is a natural part of who you are.

If you identify as gay, great! You do you! I support you on that! Yet if I'm asked what I believe to be "natural" in terms of orientation, I'm going to say bisexual. And I'm going to say that I believe gay and straight to be less "natural" relative to bisexuality. It's got nothing to do with you...that's simply my world view is all. I chose bisexuality because it feels more natural for me. That's been my life experience around sexual orientation. I wasn't born this way at all; it has and continues to feel like a choice. And I feel confident in that for myself as well.

And yet the context of sexual orientation on a cultural level right now is so convoluted and difficult to follow, I blame no one for feeling differently from how I do. All any of us can do here is our own thing. That's what I say, and that's exactly what I'm doing.

Like, I'm not an anarchist. I do believe in a state and a social structure and everything that goes along with it (i.e., social constructions). I'm not saying following along with cultural norms is in some way a bad thing. Only that it is far more specific and distinct a thing from what is "natural" according to other animals of this planet. And that it can only be a good thing to be made aware of that distinction. As in, culture versus nature (or should that be nurture versus nature?)

 

[Brodie888]

If you identify as gay, great! You do you! I support you on that! Yet if I'm asked what I believe to be "natural" in terms of orientation, I'm going to say bisexual. And I'm going to say that I believe gay and straight to be less "natural" relative to bisexuality. It's got nothing to do with you...that's simply my world view is all. I chose bisexuality because it feels more natural for me. That's been my life experience around sexual orientation. I wasn't born this way at all; it has and continues to feel like a choice. And I feel confident in that for myself as well.

And yet the context of sexual orientation on a cultural level right now is so convoluted and difficult to follow, I blame no one for feeling differently from how I do. All any of us can do here is our own thing. That's what I say, and that's exactly what I'm doing.

Like, I'm not an anarchist. I do believe in a state and a social structure and everything that goes along with it (i.e., social constructions). I'm not saying following along with cultural norms is in some way a bad thing. Only that it is far more specific and distinct a thing from what is "natural" according to other animals of this planet. And that it can only be a good thing to be made aware of that distinction. As in, culture versus nature (or should that be nurture versus nature?)

I think a distinction needs to be made between "natural" and "common".

While bisexuality is more common and natural to those people; to someone who is exclusively gay, straight or asexual, living bi is not more natural.

What you feel is right for you is essentially your orientation. But you didn't choose what feels right or wrong. The feeling was there before you made the choice.

 

[Smaccoms]

I think a distinction needs to be made between "natural" and "common".

While bisexuality is more common and natural to those people; to someone who is exclusively gay, straight or asexual, living bi is not more natural.

What you feel is right for you is essentially your orientation. But you didn't choose what feels right or wrong. The feeling was there before you made the choice.

If you want to disagree with my point of view, that's totally cool. Disagree away! Tell me your perception and interpretation of things! I'm a very curious human being. But you go far beyond doing simply that.

Do not presume to know more about my life journey than I do. I.e., don't tell me who I am; you don't know me. You are you and not me, and therefore cannot know what does or does not feel more natural to me. I'm surprised I need to explain this to you.

Just because you don't like my opinion, that doesn't give you the right to erase it with a response like this. I am who I am. Yes, I did choose what feels right to me. And I have confidence in that. If this is upsetting to you, I'm sorry. But it's not my problem.

 

[deleted1074483]

We were clearly born into different times and different cultures. And I think that's really cool

and again i know many younger people in their 20s who would also agree with me - i don't think its a 'different times' issue but i do think there is a 'cultural' issue (for want of a better expression) for sure.

 

[deleted1074483]

In my post you responded to, I also state that a sex drive is a natural and innate thing we are born with. You state this "sex drive is natural" argument in your response as though I had written otherwise. When I did not.

I'm trying to draw a distinction between sex drive and sexual orientation. I think the two are different things, with overlap of course...sort of a venn diagram situation. I think people are born with a drive toward sexual relations yes, but not with a specific image of what to be driven toward.

We were clearly born into different times and different cultures. And I think that's really cool

whilst we do indeed both agree that sex drives are innate or natural, we disagree over what that leads to.

i do appreciate your thought out responses though, everyone has an opinion and as you say we dont have to agree so long as we respect each other's perspective ;-)

 

[Smaccoms]

whilst we do indeed both agree that sex drives are innate or natural, we disagree over what that leads to.

i do appreciate your thought out responses though, everyone has an opinion and as you say we dont have to agree so long as we respect each other's perspective ;-)

Thank you! I appreciate hearing your point of view as well! I'm glad others are alive and kicking that take this subject as seriously as I do...and realize it's importance and whatnot, you know?? I apprecaite you sharing with me

 

[Brodie888]

If you want to disagree with my point of view, that's totally cool. Disagree away! Tell me your perception and interpretation of things! I'm a very curious human being. But you go far beyond doing simply that.

Do not presume to know more about my life journey than I do. I.e., don't tell me who I am; you don't know me. You are you and not me, and therefore cannot know what does or does not feel more natural to me. I'm surprised I need to explain this to you.

Just because you don't like my opinion, that doesn't give you the right to erase it with a response like this. I am who I am. Yes, I did choose what feels right to me. And I have confidence in that. If this is upsetting to you, I'm sorry. But it's not my problem.

As a gay person, the word "choose" can be quite triggering because straight bigots and conversion therapist often tell gay people that homosexuality is a choice.

So when you say your sexuality was your choice, rather than innate, you can expect comments like mine.

To be honest, we are probably on the same side of the coin. The difference is simply semantics and you are entitled to use whatever words you like.

 

[Smaccoms]

As a gay person, the word "choose" can be quite triggering because straight bigots and conversion therapist often tell gay people that homosexuality is a choice.

So when you say your sexuality was your choice, rather than innate, you can expect comments like mine.

To be honest, we are probably on the same side of the coin. The difference is simply semantics and you are entitled to use whatever words you like.

I can see my point of view is upsetting to you. And I am sorry that it is. Your struggle continues. It can be difficult to build self-confidence when much of the world would simply rather you not have any at all. As a fellow queer person, I can say that it seriously sucks.

The thing is, the concept that your sexuality is a choice...there's nothing wrong with it. In fact, it's quite fitting when considering the right to self-determination. I think conservatives have this part right. Let's say everyone chooses to be straight, gay, or bisexual. So?? And?? Sounds good to me!!

What they are trying to say (but won't) is this: "Sexuality is a choice, AND straight is the only right choice!" What utter bullshit!! It's homophobia pure and simple. Don't feel the need to take that shit seriously. If this point of view upsets you, than you might be dealing with some internalized homophobia. Which is understandable given the social structure and culture we have been born into. Like I said above, this shit sucks.

Still, don't be that guy that goes, "Oh, if it were a choice, then I made the wrong one. So it can't be a choice...IT'S NOT MY FAULT I WAS BORN WRONG!" So reactionary! That's not going to help you. That's going to make things worse for you. Maybe that's the goal of these conservatives in the first place??

The argument is often made simply because it's widely known to be taken as threatening by those in our community. And it puts many of us into a defensive stance. But why?? Do you not have confidence that you made the right choice for yourself?? I may personally believe that bisexuality is the most natural, and it has been an active choice I made. But I also believe in a right to self-determination. For everyone. When someone tells me sexuality is a choice, I say YUP! I tell them that I love the choice I made! I tell them that I'm a dare devil, that I live life on the edge! YOLO BETCH! And if they don't like it, I tell them to grow up...and to fuck off.

I think we should reclaim the word "choose". I see no reason for why it should be triggering for anyone in the Queer Community.

 

[1373263]

I chose to try sex with a man initially, and have more recently chosen to try sex exclusively with men; I don't care if that "makes" me "gay" or "bisexual".
I didn't choose to be attracted to men, it's a part if me which gave me huge trouble for some period of time. It's not going away and I'm actually enjoying developing a relationship with a man which is more than just sexual, although the sex aspect still blows me away.

 

[deleted1074483]

I knew I was gay at a young age, and probably bi to be honest. This was in the early 70's so it was easier to contemplate than it might have been in earlier generations. Women's Lib , Gay Liberation, all manner of new thought, and the Hippies, were everywhere.

I have this interviewer who I think makes the best case for leaving people to their own nature.
I think he is right on point:
View attachment 79322191

I don't know who the interviewer is, but in the responses I'm seeing the reality become clear of other people and their orientation being just the same as ourselves. Where borderline homophobes have the truth dawn on them as we watch.

I find it very moving.

great vid and makes people on the street being interviewed think about their own preconceptions. I've said the same to people who have asked me if its its been a choice and you can see that look of realization on their faces for sure.