I wanted an unfiltered glimpse into the male sexual psyche...

[AllieHeidi]

Lol..ran out of time to edit. Meant to say "not found a single strong moral argument not completely condoning sex outside of marriage...". It's always an option.

I suppose me flipping the script on you multiple times with the examples of men possibly raising other men's babies was lost on you.

I guess the concept of a wife leaving her husband for her lover (and the true biological father of her kid(s)) while her none-the-wiser and wronged, yet faithful, husband is left still having to pay alimony and child support for all of her kids because any children born within that marriage are his by law, DNA be damned, just went completely over your head.

It's easy when you're stuck in the mindset that it's only men that cheat. A claim I never made. I just said they statistically cheat more. But both sexes are definitely guilty as a whole.

I understand that men are the topic of this thread, but you're talking about something that individuals from both sexes do, in general (cheating). And regardless of who is cheating on whom, it is the man that ends up either shooting himself in the foot and getting man-handled in family court or having his heart unfairly trampled on...and then getting man-handled in family court. But that just blew right on past you because according to you, all women are apparently nuns and the real focus here is that women "should just understand and give men a break" because..."muh urges."

God, have I never been more grateful to not be sexually attracted to men. I feel sorry for straight women sometimes. And I mean that sincerely.

 

[TryHarrd]

I suppose me flipping the script on you multiple times with the examples of men possibly raising other men's babies was lost on you.

I guess the concept of a wife leaving her husband for her lover (and the true biological father of her kid(s)) while her none-the-wiser and wronged, yet faithful, husband is left still having to pay alimony and child support for all of her kids because any children born within that marriage are his by law, DNA be damned, just went completely over your head.

It's easy when you're stuck in the mindset that it's only men that cheat. A claim I never made. I just said they statistically cheat more. But both sexes are definitely guilty as a whole.

I understand that men are the topic of this thread, but you're talking about something that individuals from both sexes do, in general (cheating). And regardless of who is cheating on whom, it is the man that ends up either shooting himself in the foot and getting man-handled in family court or having his heart unfairly trampled on...and then getting man-handled in family court. But that just blew right on past you because according to you, all women are apparently nuns and the real focus here is that women "should just understand and give men a break" because..."muh urges."

God, have I never been more grateful to not be sexually attracted to men. I feel sorry for straight women sometimes. And I mean that sincerely.

Well the thread was asking about the male psych Can absolutely go the other way - I did mention I'd do the same for my wife - but in general men have a higher sexual drive than women. And this isn't their fault and they shouldn't get crucified for it.

 

[AllieHeidi]

this isn't their fault and they shouldn't get crucified for it.

I have an assortment of Japanese steel, high-quality, knives in my kitchen. It's not my fault that I have them. However, if I ever use them to harm someone, it is 100% my fault, and my subsequent crucifixtion would be well-earned and justified.

 

[huguest]

So,

Men are stupid if they cheat
Men are loser if women cheat them.
Men are man-handled by law if women cheat them and try to get out of the relation.
Men have more urge then women but suck it up.
Women don't really need men anymore for living necessity or procreating.
Men could at best be only a provider
Men are tagged as "violent" and "oppressor" by society on women
Society treat women as victim and need to be save. So men have the role of the bad guy.

Geez, I wouldn't want to be a men!
No wonder some men just explode and women can't find virtuous men anymore.

It's a sad situation. Be faithful is a virtue because it's require self control. I would even say it's require more control for a men then it's require for the women because of the hormone and women can easily go by without men.

Again, virtue acquire when we have good example and frankly, society and women don't underline those good example. It's so much easier to just point out the wrong and bad example.

We are responsible of our action. But like many psychological studies, Tag a group of people as stupid, they will act according to your belief.

I think there's a lot of men that responded to you and told you that they remained faithful against all odds.

In the end I still question the purpose of your post. For a women that don't want nothing to do with men.

 

[TryHarrd]

I have an assortment of Japanese steel, high-quality, knives in my kitchen. It's not my fault that I have them. However, if I ever use them to harm someone, it is 100% my fault, and my subsequent crucifixtion would be well-earned and justified.

But the knives didn't become sharp by themselves (but through a process outside their control). Bad analogy.

You still come off assuming men and women are the same. If I've got the willpower, why don't you? Sounds like you learnt about men and women from the Bible. Eve coming from Adam's rib. But men and women are fundamentally different and the survival of our species depends on it. My wife can be a little over emotional during her period, but I don't crucify her for it. It's part of what it is to be a women. Men are, in general, more hornier than women. Don't crucify them for it. And in the same way I accommodate my wife during her period, you need to accommodate men being horny. If you tell them just deal with it because you can, you lack empathy and are a shitty partner. This will then build resentment and drive them to consider cheating, even if they don't act on it. And I'm sure in your puritan outlook, considering cheating is nearly as bad as cheating itself.

 

[TryHarrd]

So,

Men are stupid if they cheat
Men are loser if women cheat them.
Men are man-handled by law if women cheat them and try to get out of the relation.
Men have more urge then women but suck it up.
Women don't really need men anymore for living necessity or procreating.
Men could at best be only a provider
Men are tagged as "violent" and "oppressor" by society on women
Society treat women as victim and need to be save. So men have the role of the bad guy.

Geez, I wouldn't want to be a men!
No wonder some men just explode and women can't find virtuous men anymore.

It's a sad situation. Be faithful is a virtue because it's require self control. I would even say it's require more control for a men then it's require for the women because of the hormone and women can easily go by without men.

Again, virtue acquire when we have good example and frankly, society and women don't underline those good example. It's so much easier to just point out the wrong and bad example.

We are responsible of our action. But like many psychological studies, Tag a group of people as stupid, they will act according to your belief.

I think there's a lot of men that responded to you and told you that they remained faithful against all odds.

In the end I still question the purpose of your post. For a women that don't want nothing to do with men.

Yep, I agree, maybe the title should be "I'll refuse to accept any version of the male psyche different to how I think". Not much development of ideas or support (like ok, so how can we manage a man's sexual needs if greater then their partners?), just lots of condemnation :-( I'm sure there are lots of women out that could be helped with a solution to this issue.

 

[Tight_N_Juicy]

To the guys complaining about this thread being anti man.... Uh... You must not explore much of the site.

And, we know. Not all men. We. Know. We also know (myself and others in this thread, I'm not speaking for all women) that men have their own frustrations that we don't experience. I don't think that's being dismissed.

 

[AllieHeidi]

So,

Men are stupid if they cheat
Men are loser if women cheat them.
Men are man-handled by law if women cheat them and try to get out of the relation.
Men have more urge then women but suck it up.
Women don't really need men anymore for living necessity or procreating.
Men could at best be only a provider
Men are tagged as "violent" and "oppressor" by society on women
Society treat women as victim and need to be save. So men have the role of the bad guy.

Geez, I wouldn't want to be a men!
No wonder some men just explode and women can't find virtuous men anymore.

It's a sad situation. Be faithful is a virtue because it's require self control. I would even say it's require more control for a men then it's require for the women because of the hormone and women can easily go by without men.

Again, virtue acquire when we have good example and frankly, society and women don't underline those good example. It's so much easier to just point out the wrong and bad example.

We are responsible of our action. But like many psychological studies, Tag a group of people as stupid, they will act according to your belief.

I think there's a lot of men that responded to you and told you that they remained faithful against all odds.

In the end I still question the purpose of your post. For a women that don't want nothing to do with men.

I'm not sure if you caught on to this, but the conversation took a rather harsh pivot into reality when @TryHarrd claimed his wife would be "stupid" for leaving him for cheating and then proceeded to list off all of the generic reasons why he thinks she needs him as though we're still in 1953.

I merely decided to paint a very brutal picture of the reality of how the modern world, indeed, works against men in many ways in an apparently failed attempt to get him to see that he would be the far more stupid one for cheating in the first place.

That is all.

 

[FrankieGuile]

Spock is mind-melding with Kirk, whose mind has been transferred into the body of the woman pictured who has transferred her mind into his body so she can pursue nefarious ends

Turnabout Intruder. The last episode of TOS.

 

[huguest]

I'm not sure if you caught on to this, but the conversation took a rather harsh pivot into reality when @TryHarrd claimed his wife would be "stupid" for leaving him for cheating and then proceeded to list off all of the generic reasons why he thinks she needs him as though we're still in 1953.

I merely decided to paint a very brutal picture of the reality of how the modern world, indeed, works against men in many ways in an apparently failed attempt to get him to see that he would be the far more stupid one for cheating in the first place.

That is all.

I do understand your point of view and I'm with you cheating is inacceptable. You do have valid points and it would be hard to justify cheating. Tight_N_juicy is correct, I do not venture much in the site and I'm certain that the level of absurdity is very high there is not doubt about it. it's a sex website after all.

So I'm not here to argue with you.

I'm just not comfortable with the way your doing your little science project.
1) why not post it in the men section and ask if it's concern the male psyche?
2) A title like "I wanted an unfiltered glimpse into the male sexual psyche" and then argue in the "women issue" ?!
3) falling back on the "cheating argument" knowing very well that it's your relation wound. Because the male sexual psyche is just cheating?!
4) not including women side of the cheating argument, well it's make for a nice "science" project.
5) giving advice in a form "My findings" saying that most men are bound to cheat. and giving the only solution is live without men. It's resemble a lot of your life style.
6) admitting that your emotion are at the heart of this topic.
7) admitting that you don't want nothing to do with men.
8) when I suggest a solution of a society that would expose men with better values, you do not explore it and only answer "Men will survive my bitter and inane little rants just fine".

I think the real "women issue" here is you dealing with your relation wound with men since they no longer are part of your love life. I don't blame you I got issue too.

I'm just not comfortable with the way your doing it because your are a very intelligent women.

For my part, I'm tired of been tagged as "bad" (yes I know you didn't say it your too clever for that).
Violent Men here, oppression there, cheater and anything in between. I miss the day's when "strong", "hard working", "gallant", "needed", "faithful" was tagged on men. They are My values and the value of many men. Just not on the mouth of society and woman in general. (because everyone have relation trauma).

I know, don't put the hat if it's doesn't fit you, anyway. I need a bit of positive thinking. Solution!

I try to change this feeling in my own way. Cary on.

 

[TryHarrd]

In my defence again, I have not slept with anyone outside marriage (so pls put away torches and pitchforks), but I do like to play around with ideas and this post brings up some of the most important and interesting ideas I believe we face. I would like to try and get a better understanding of the male pysche as well, especially in relation to these questions.

1) What does 'cheating' really mean?
2) What role does intimacy have in cheating?
3) Can you cheat without having sex?
4) Can you have sex outside marriage without your partner knowing without it being cheating?
5) What weight should sex be given within a marriage?
6) Can one partner ignore the sex drive of the other in a justified way?
7) Is there a point, and if so where is that point, when a partner is justified in seeking sex outside marriage?
8) Does sex outside marriage negate all other the good things a marriage provides?

Early in a relationship these issues aren't so important, but if you check the ages of many of the men on these forums who discuss sexual dysfunction in their relationships, it becomes more and more important as time goes on. I just found out a sexless marriage is defined as having sex less than twice a month - holy shit - I reckon there would be heaps of poor couples out there in sexless marriages who are really unhappy without knowing a way forward.

I personally believe answers from men and women (in general) about the questions above will be quite different, and therefore again, the solution will lie somewhere in the middle. It would be a great thing to test.

 

[Sagittarius84]

I personally believe answers from men and women (in general) about the questions above will be quite different, and therefore again, the solution will lie somewhere in the middle. It would be a great thing to test.

Define "solution" and "middle"...because I believe between men and women generally those definitions are going to vary widely as well. All you're really going to test in the end is the degrees of hubris or apathy at play when those aforementioned questions are answered.

 

[TryHarrd]

Define "solution" and "middle"...because I believe between men and women generally those definitions are going to vary widely as well. All you're really going to test in the end is the degrees of hubris or apathy at play when those aforementioned questions are answered.

True @Sagittarius84 but things can't be completely relative.

I'm sure reading this thread most would agree what we are discussing has something to do with harmony within a relationship (affected by the male psyche) and it's impact on the family - the classic western monogomous atomic family in this case - but this model of family life is not universal. Tribal cultures don't necessarily practice monogamy for instance.

I'm not sure what the best model for harmony is - it's why I'm in this conversation - but for westerners, the Christian conception of family and marriage may have done it's day, especially in light of the liberation of women's rights. Let's agree, it's a terribly submissive relationship for women anyway. Changing names, suspending careers to have kids, domestic duties. I'm sure I've read somewhere women are happier if single in later life than if married, while men are the opposite.

Putting my wife's happiness as my priority means not nagging her for sex - but she just needs to rest her feet on me and that's enough. My erection is not intentional. She then feels pressure to provide, gets frustrated, and this all becomes a thing so when I try to initiate sex at another more appropriate time it's met with 'oh not again'. A cycle begins and it ends with both us feeling resentment towards each other which bubbles up in other areas of our relationship. How is this a good model??

Just putting it out there but whatever we define as cheating or marriage or commitment or intimacy has to change because it's no longer sufficient for dealing with either the male or female psyche and making people miserable.

 

[Sagittarius84]

I'm sure reading this thread most would agree what we are discussing has something to do with harmony within a relationship (affected by the male psyche)

This right here...I think you need to learn how to read a room. They don't care, but for the consequences they may endure as a result. If men were wholly unaggressive, or non dominant in both physicality or sociocultural structure the male psyche when it comes to relationships would be a moot point.

 

[TryHarrd]

This right here...I think you need to learn how to read a room. They don't care, but for the consequences they may endure as a result. If men were wholly unaggressive, or non dominant in both physicality or sociocultural structure the male psyche when it comes to relationships would be a moot point.

I know I'm not playing ball with the original author, but I'm here for inspiration not validation. This is a real issue and already the thread has been thought provoking. Maybe it now serves a better purpose than just man bashing. And disagree with your point, power can go either way, just from an evolutionary stand point, men are usually in the driving seat. But this is contingent.

 

[Sagittarius84]

I know I'm not playing ball with the original author, but I'm here for inspiration not validation. This is a real issue and already the thread has been thought provoking. Maybe it now serves a better purpose than just man bashing. And disagree with your point, power can go either way, just from an evolutionary stand point, men are usually in the driving seat. But this is contingent.

I'm telling you right now unless you serve a specific purpose for them, they don't care, and even if you do fulfill that purpose they don't really care as long as you fulfill the purpose.
Compromise is a structure contingent not only upon the respective value you bring to the table, but also as a function of how the opposing side actually values you.
Any aspect of the male psyche that would require some measure of compromise or mitigation from their end is a non starter until after you become indispensable, everything else is going to be a pointless thought exercise, especially when looking at the realm of sex and relationships.

 

[Sagittarius84]

The best, and I mean absolute best thing for the male psyche when it comes to sex? I have to give it up to the ladies, because they've been telling us this for years; I'd always taken it as snark, malevolence, or pure apathy, but it's a glorious truth:

Nobody cares about your boner.
You care about "her" comfort, you care about her orgasm, you care about all of the things because unless you're valuable enough not to, you don't have a choice, but you don't ever expect her, individually, or them collectively to care about yours because they don't and never will.

 

[TryHarrd]

The best, and I mean absolute best thing for the male psyche when it comes to sex? I have to give it up to the ladies, because they've been telling us this for years; I'd always taken it as snark, malevolence, or pure apathy, but it's a glorious truth:

Nobody cares about your boner.
You care about "her" comfort, you care about her orgasm, you care about all of the things because unless you're valuable enough not to, you don't have a choice, but you don't ever expect her, individually, or them collectively to care about yours because they don't and never will.

This is where we disagree. I think women care about boners a hell of lot more than they are willing to own up to. They may put up a front, but long term, not being able to satisfy the sexual urges of your partner adds to the inadequecies already burdening them - am I a good mother? Am I good wife? - compounding their already suffering self doubt. It's exactly the same sort of validation men seek, but they need to make their partner orgasm instead.

 

[TryHarrd]

Lol..this just came to me, a glimpse into the female psyche I believe a woman needs to feel as if she has 'tamed' their partner's boner, much like a horse, and have dominance and control over it. You can't have a wild penis in a relationship. But this means a battle of wills at every encounter - do you have what it takes to stay in control? And this is where women struggle because for men, getting a boner is part of their nature.

 

[Tight_N_Juicy]

Lol..this just came to me, a glimpse into the female psyche I believe a woman needs to feel as if she has 'tamed' their partner's boner, much like a horse, and have dominance and control over it. You can't have a wild penis in a relationship. But this means a battle of wills at every encounter - do you have what it takes to stay in control? And this is where women struggle because for men, getting a boner is part of their nature.

Nah. My man's dick is untamable. And I'm happy for him to enjoy it as much as he can before he feeds the worms, or fertilizes whatever he may when his body stops.

I don't control him. He doesn't control me. Stop projecting your relationship onto everyone who isn't in it. You are in your shoes. Your partner doesn't represent anyone but themself.